Hi, I'm Skeptical...

[Dal]

Btw I don't give a fuck about what she did at the Super Bowl.. Sure it was a dumb ideas by whoever came up with it.. But remember this occurred about 5-6 months after the Britney/Madonna/Christina kiss at the VMAs (when they shoved the camera in Justin's face to get his reaction the moment it happened)... Clearly this was a pre-orchestrated stint to try and top Madonna and it failed miserably.. Whoever came up with that stunt should've been fired.. And Janet did not help herself one bit in the months to follow by avoiding the topic as much as possible.. And even when she did talk about it, she was even more vague than she's been just in the last 3 months.. She could've saved her career, but she chose not to.. And she's been dealing with the aftermath ever since unfortunately..

my point is, you can be a Stan of a fan and still understand that Janet made mistakes in her career and lied about them ("I lived through my mistakes, it's just a part of growing")...

[Dal]

The fact that she was wearing that ridiculous nipple ring (or whatever the hell it was) tells me that their little stunt was intentional. Obviously they never anticipated just how much backlash they would receive for it, but oh well...

Anyway, I pretty much agree with everything in the original post but this really could have just gone into the venting thread.

thank you for understanding my point of view...

 

and yes you're right, it probably should've gone into the venting thread..

[Aquaria]

I know that sounds good to you, but I'd take a album as amazing as Unbreakable, and no promo, vs. a Madonna album, and her desperate antics making her the laughing stock all over. Like Janet getting flack over the tour (and actually no everyones more so posting about the fans, hell Wendy Williams went in on US not her LOFL I loved it...she still backhandedly shaded Janet as she ofourse would LOL), but it's nowhere near the flack Madonna was getting for her desperation. I'll take the album, gladly but as I said in the past here many times, the album was all I REALLY wanted, Discipline could not have been the last, that wouldn't sit right in my soul. This could (I don't think it is, but then again Im not searching for shit just sitting back and watching what happens) and I'd be content with her legacy in my eyes honestly. HONORED that I got to see her live this tour but I didn't even need that, this album was all I wanted & needed.

You do know the inside of the bra could've been black, like it obviously wasn't just a random bra you get at Sears (like all costume clothing isn't) but I've seen many bras that were hand created (friends with like 2 designers) and they have designs on the outside but are jet black or sometimes white on the inside, moe so that if you're just wearing that it's not see through.

That's just Madonna's antics which she's been doing her whole career. It's just so cringeworthy now because she's getting older. But she's always been like that. At the end of the day, she shows up and she works her fucking ass off. Maybe Janet doesn't look desperate (except not to tour) but she comes off looking lazy and unprofessional which is much worse. 

[jarrylf]

Try again jerry!

The official statement was that there was meant to be a red bra left.. Not a black bra.. And even if it was meant to be a bra left there (in any color) wtf was the point of doing that..?!  Don't u think that stunt alone would've been enough to tarnish her career..whether there was a bra left in place or not..? (At least it would be enough for her to receive some sort of backlash) Plus wouldn't have her nipple shield most likely shone through..?!

No need to "try again", because you didn't get the point, doesn't make it less valid, I said the inside could be black (which it is) and the outside can be all completely red, with no visible hint of black, seen it done with all kinds of colors, So no, I never said "red & black" I said red with black under, it's a costume thing, which is why for me where that's kind of my world right now even, nothing about it being a accident sounds or looks far fetched, and there's been no smoking gun (including the pic posted) that's radically changed my opinion.

That's just Madonna's antics which she's been doing her whole career. It's just so cringeworthy now because she's getting older. But she's always been like that. At the end of the day, she shows up and she works her fucking ass off. Maybe Janet doesn't look desperate (except not to tour) but she comes off looking lazy and unprofessional which is much worse. 

From what I see with the media & casual fans, Janet more so comes off as unbothered, like she knows what she got, and doesnt' have to do anything, that's just from my observation and conversations with non-fans or people with no interest. I only get lazy & unprofessional from former fans or fans on the verge of becoming former fans. Im just not here and never have been here for desperate, I hate that look.

 

Edited April 12, 2016 by jarrylf

[hotboy06]

Janet is notoriously private.  I get that.  But the way social media nowadays, and this instant gratification for our faves to feed our needs, has made it damn near impossible to keep that privacy.  I'm glad she's keeping us informed, but at the same time, it's kinda crazy to be starting a family in the middle of a tour. 

I'm not pressed either way because I've seen her in concert and bought the album.

[Rock & Roll Hall of Game]

No need to "try again", because you didn't get the point, doesn't make it less valid, I said the inside could be black (which it is) and the outside can be all completely red, with no visible hint of black, seen it done with all kinds of colors, So no, I never said "red & black" I said red with black under, it's a costume thing, which is why for me where that's kind of my world right now even, nothing about it being a accident sounds or looks far fetched, and there's been no smoking gun (including the pic posted) that's radically changed my opinion.

SHEEEEEPPPP OMFG SHEEEEEEP 

 

[Dal]

No need to "try again", because you didn't get the point, doesn't make it less valid, I said the inside could be black (which it is) and the outside can be all completely red, with no visible hint of black, seen it done with all kinds of colors, So no, I never said "red & black" I said red with black under, it's a costume thing, which is why for me where that's kind of my world right now even, nothing about it being a accident sounds or looks far fetched, and there's been no smoking gun (including the pic posted) that's radically changed my opinion.

that photo is the smoking gun bruh..  There is clearly no other bra in that cup ... You are reeeaching with that one jerry...

look, Janet messed up.. And she lied about it to save her ass, unsuccessfully.. Sure she's bounced back in a lot of ways, but her career never got back on track, and it was her very own doing.. Career suicide..

and Jerry it is clear to me that, like Norman, you are nothing more than a sheep with fat blinders on so you don't see the true facts objectively..

At least explain what the point of showcasing her bra would've been (if that was really what was meant to happen) to 100mil viewers...

Does that scenario make anymore type of sense..?! 

[Freexone1]

SHEEEEEPPPP OMFG SHEEEEEEP 

 

ok so assuming the theory that it was a stunt, you post a photo to prove it but please explain to me the look on Janet's face. That look is not one of "haha it worked", it's a look of "shit, what just happened". And then there was the photos of her being taken away in a towel and the rumours from dancers she was seen crying back stage. Explain please?

I suppose she put saline in her eyes to fake cry and the shocked looks was acting even though the lights were already off?? Lol

[Rock & Roll Hall of Game]

If you don't agree to a conspiracy theory, you're called a sheeeeeeep  

[Dal]

ok so assuming the theory that it was a stunt, you post a photo to prove it but please explain to me the look on Janet's face. That look is not one of "haha it worked", it's a look of "shit, what just happened". And then there was the photos of her being taken away in a towel and the rumours from dancers she was seen crying back stage. Explain please?

I suppose she put saline in her eyes to fake cry and the shocked looks was acting even though the lights were already off?? Lol

she is an actress!! Lol and those "rumors" about her crying.....merely rumors.. The point was to get people to talk, but not in a bashing way... It backfired, plain and simple.. Even Justin admitted the idea wasn't thought out carefully and it was dumb...

[Rock & Roll Hall of Game]

ok so assuming the theory that it was a stunt, you post a photo to prove it but please explain to me the look on Janet's face. That look is not one of "haha it worked", it's a look of "shit, what just happened". And then there was the photos of her being taken away in a towel and the rumours from dancers she was seen crying back stage. Explain please?

I suppose she put saline in her eyes to fake cry and the shocked looks was acting even though the lights were already off?? Lol

He'll say "she's an actor... They're all actors.  You're a god damn sheeeeeeep"

I love how he's speculating Janet's downfall but ask him about MJ napping with boys and feeding them wine and he'll get all offensive and upset. 

[Aquaria]

No need to "try again", because you didn't get the point, doesn't make it less valid, I said the inside could be black (which it is) and the outside can be all completely red, with no visible hint of black, seen it done with all kinds of colors, So no, I never said "red & black" I said red with black under, it's a costume thing, which is why for me where that's kind of my world right now even, nothing about it being a accident sounds or looks far fetched, and there's been no smoking gun (including the pic posted) that's radically changed my opinion.

From what I see with the media & casual fans, Janet more so comes off as unbothered, like she knows what she got, and doesnt' have to do anything, that's just from my observation and conversations with non-fans or people with no interest. I only get lazy & unprofessional from former fans or fans on the verge of becoming former fans. Im just not here and never have been here for desperate, I hate that look.

 

She had that before this mess of a tour and era.

[jarrylf]

that photo is the smoking gun bruh..  There is clearly no other bra in that cup ... You are reeeaching with that one jerry...

look, Janet messed up.. And she lied about it to save her ass, unsuccessfully.. Sure she's bounced back in a lot of ways, but her career never got back on track, and it was her very own doing.. Career suicide..

and Jerry it is clear to me that, like Norman, you are nothing more than a sheep with fat blinders on so you don't see the true facts objectively..

At least explain what the point of showcasing her bra would've been (if that was really what was meant to happen) to 100mil viewers...

Does that scenario make anymore type of sense..?! 

It really isn't, and I think you'd actually have to have his had to know whether or not there was another bra. Red outside and black inside is possible, it happens alot the red fabric might not feel good on the skin, they might have last minute hot glue something, it's something that's common in the costume world. I can't reach for what I've known based on my observations in cases beyond this incident, hell I've seen this type of thing on Top Model, FaceOff, & RuPauls Drag Race. I can understand it's not exactly conventional or "normal" but the costume world has MANY tricks when it comes to Underwear, and a red bra with a black inside is pretty basic with that stuff (and I'm no fashion guy, but I do pay attention to costume stuff because I do love costumes, so I pay closer attention to the workings of them). How could I explain what it would've been unless I was working on it with her & Gil & the director? I never said I knew how the routine should've gone, I don't, but I know making out a case over what the inside looked like isn't much of a good case. And you call my point of view "sheep", I call yours cynical, the truth for both is probably in the middle but I don't care, you're skeptical and cynical of her and that works for you, and I treat her like I treat all, I don't doubt their word or intentions until they give me reason to that's relevant to the subject at hand. So again if the color of the inside of the cup is the reason we're supposed to be positive it was planned, that doesn't work for me, it's just too common in costumes. That's not "Fan goggles" that's my experience in my everyday life LOL

 

She had that before this mess of a tour and era.

With the way the media and casual fans are talking she still does, they're having fun with the "baby @ 50" headlines, but they're not really reading into "is she lying, is she lazy", that's more so the fans from what I've seen.

Edited April 12, 2016 by jarrylf

[Dal]

I love how he's speculating Janet's downfall but ask him about MJ napping with boys and feeding them wine and he'll get all offensive and upset. 

I'm a fan... Not a blind follower..

I am able to realize and a recognize when people I admire make mistakes.. I don't make excuses for them..

MJ was the leader of his own public demise, that much I do understand..

What I don't understand is how you can be so unable to pull away your Janet fan goggles and see things from an objective point of view..

if that's something you're unable to do, then yes you are clearly a sheep... Baaahh!!

[Dal]

It really isn't, and I think you'd actually have to have his had to know whether or not there was another bra. Red outside and black inside is possible, it happens alot the red fabric might not feel good on the skin, they might have last minute hot glue something, it's something that's common in the costume world. I can't reach for what I've known based on my observations in cases beyond this incident, hell I've seen this type of thing on Top Model, FaceOff, & RuPauls Drag Race. I can understand it's not exactly conventional or "normal" but the costume world has MANY tricks when it comes to Underwear, and a red bra with a black inside is pretty basic with that stuff (and I'm no fashion guy, but I do pay attention to costume stuff because I do love costumes, so I pay closer attention to the workings of them). How could I explain what it would've been unless I was working on it with her & Gil & the director? I never said I knew how the routine should've gone, I don't, but I know making out a case over what the inside looked like isn't much of a good case. And you call my point of view "sheep", I call yours cynical, the truth for both is probably in the middle but I don't care.

 Ok that says it all..

please explain to me where that black bra cup was at?! It's amazingly laughable to me that you sincerely believe that there was another bra underneath the cup and above her nipple jewelry... 

[Aquaria]

It really isn't, and I think you'd actually have to have his had to know whether or not there was another bra. Red outside and black inside is possible, it happens alot the red fabric might not feel good on the skin, they might have last minute hot glue something, it's something that's common in the costume world. I can't reach for what I've known based on my observations in cases beyond this incident, hell I've seen this type of thing on Top Model, FaceOff, & RuPauls Drag Race. I can understand it's not exactly conventional or "normal" but the costume world has MANY tricks when it comes to Underwear, and a red bra with a black inside is pretty basic with that stuff (and I'm no fashion guy, but I do pay attention to costume stuff because I do love costumes, so I pay closer attention to the workings of them). How could I explain what it would've been unless I was working on it with her & Gil & the director? I never said I knew how the routine should've gone, I don't, but I know making out a case over what the inside looked like isn't much of a good case. And you call my point of view "sheep", I call yours cynical, the truth for both is probably in the middle but I don't care, you're skeptical and cynical of her and that works for you, and I treat her like I treat all, I don't doubt their word or intentions until they give me reason to that's relevant to the subject at hand. So again if the color of the inside of the cup is the reason we're supposed to be positive it was planned, that doesn't work for me, it's just too common in costumes. That's not "Fan goggles" that's my experience in my everyday life LOL

 

With the way the media and casual fans are talking she still does, they're having fun with the "baby @ 50" headlines, but they're not really reading into "is she lying, is she lazy", that's more so the fans from what I've seen.

Uhh... Yeah they are. Everyone's saying how mad her fans are over the way the tour was handled and the cancellations.  

[jarrylf]

 Ok that says it all..

please explain to me where that black bra cup was at?! It's amazingly laughable to me that you sincerely believe that there was another bra underneath the cup and above her nipple jewelry... 

I find it pretty laughable that you think it's that easy or that you think you know or have all the evidence that people who's job it is both at the time and in that situation or in my situation who have experience and understandings with costumes don't know or haven't seen before. The angle confirms that the black part was supposed to come off just like we saw in the rehearsal footage, it does not change that there easily could've been another cup underneath. It's enough for you to clearly make up your mind on and be convinced, but not me, this pic isn't new, the other 1 wasn't. I've seen all kinds of pics and closeups from this performance from many angles, sorry. Again, it's more of a "this is my career" thing than a "I don't want to think they lyin cause I like they music" thing.  

Uhh... Yeah they are. Everyone's saying how mad her fans are over the way the tour was handled and the cancellations.  

Yea but again that's more so directed at us not her, with her they're more so reacting over the news still, like this news has the media interested, they aren't ridiculing her (they slightly were when it came out about the no refund mess, but that lasted like 2 days), but really it's the fans and haters that have been dragging the era

[Dal]

I find it pretty laughable that you think it's that easy or that you think you know or have all the evidence that people who's job it is both at the time and in that situation or in my situation who have experience and understandings with costumes don't know or haven't seen before. The angle confirms that the black part was supposed to come off just like we saw in the rehearsal footage, it does not change that there easily could've been another cup underneath. It's enough for you to clearly make up your mind on and be convinced, but not me, this pic isn't new, the other 1 wasn't. I've seen all kinds of pics and closeups from this performance from many angles, sorry. Again, it's more of a "this is my career" thing than a "I don't want to think they lyin cause I like they music" thing.  

what?! Your reply was jumbled, to say the least..

yea the pic shows the outer black cup was meant to come off, obviously that was the plan! Lol

but if there is meant to be a whole 'nother black cup underneath the outer black cup (oh geez ?), then instead of seeing her skin in that pic through the "crack" in the buttons, we should theoretically see the black bra underneath..

But guess what...?!

it was never there because the overall intention was to have her titty pop out ("bet I'll have you NAKED by the end of this song") and stun everyone and play it off like it wasn't meant to happen.. Basically to 1-up MTV and Madonna and Britney for their stunt they pulled months before, that had everyone talking..

But this is going nowhere Jerry so don't even bother replying back to me..

Baaaah!!

[Dal]

Ask you must remember folks that Janet was NOT afraid to show her tit.. Less than 2 years before the Super Bowl she showed her boob flopping around (nipple and errthang) while she walked into the waterfall at the start of her AFY tour special on HBO (a much more appropriate platform/channel to showcase her own nudity, as opposed to the SB)..

so nobody can say that flashing her tit was beneath her.. Obviously it wasn't..

[PensivePutana]

You know things are bad when people start re-litigating Nipplegate. 

[Rock & Roll Hall of Game]

You know thinks are bad when people start re-litigating Nipplegate. 

Bc they have nothing else to say #oop

oh.. And you're a sheep 

[jarrylf]

what?! Your reply was jumbled, to say the least..

yea the pic shows the outer black cup was meant to come off, obviously that was the plan! Lol

but if there is meant to be a whole 'nother black cup underneath the outer black cup (oh geez ?), then instead of seeing her skin in that pic through the "crack" in the buttons, we should theoretically see the black bra underneath..

But guess what...?!

it was never there because the overall intention was to have her titty pop out ("bet I'll have you NAKED by the end of this song") and stun everyone and play it off like it wasn't meant to happen.. Basically to 1-up MTV and Madonna and Britney for their stunt they pulled months before, that had everyone talking..

But this is going nowhere Jerry so don't even bother replying back to me..

Baaaah!!

Not necissarily, it could've been a cup to let the sides show, give a illusion of something that wasn't, again, not new. And guess what, the problem is, janet never had a a career of trying to "1 up" performances that everyone was talking about, I mean if she did a performance in a thong and carrying around a lizard after Britney did the sexy costume with a snake, I'd give you that "hey, that's how Janet does, she likes to try to upstage others" but that's just not factual. And Yea ofcourse it's not going anywhere, but yea you want to reignite the debate, here it is, and like with most debates, there's 2 different sides, and in this case neither side knows enough to  have their mind 100% made up, so it'll always be a topic that goes on & on.

Ask you must remember folks that Janet was NOT afraid to show her tit.. Less than 2 years before the Super Bowl she showed her boob flopping around (nipple and errthang) while she walked into the waterfall at the start of her AFY tour special on HBO (a much more appropriate platform/channel to showcase her own nudity, as opposed to the SB)..

so nobody can say that flashing her tit was beneath her.. Obviously it wasn't..

HBO, is HBO, they show tit's all the time and say fuck, show fucking, The Superbowl is aired on a Primetime network. Showing her tits wasn't beneath her but showing it on a Primetime network is not something that before that she was known for, stunts in general on her Live Network TV performances weren't.And she obviously knows the difference between the 2 considering she's been working on TV and with many networks since she was a kid, she knows what's allowed and what's not.

Bc they have nothing else to say #oop

oh.. And you're a sheep 

BITCH QUITIT!!!

[Jodienda76]

I know that sounds good to you, but I'd take a album as amazing as Unbreakable, and no promo, vs. a Madonna album, and her desperate antics making her the laughing stock all over. Like Janet getting flack over the tour (and actually no everyones more so posting about the fans, hell Wendy Williams went in on US not her LOFL I loved it...she still backhandedly shaded Janet as she ofourse would LOL), but it's nowhere near the flack Madonna was getting for her desperation. I'll take the album, gladly but as I said in the past here many times, the album was all I REALLY wanted, Discipline could not have been the last, that wouldn't sit right in my soul. This could (I don't think it is, but then again Im not searching for shit just sitting back and watching what happens) and I'd be content with her legacy in my eyes honestly. HONORED that I got to see her live this tour but I didn't even need that, this album was all I wanted & needed.

You do know the inside of the bra could've been black, like it obviously wasn't just a random bra you get at Sears (like all costume clothing isn't) but I've seen many bras that were hand created (friends with like 2 designers) and they have designs on the outside but are jet black or sometimes white on the inside, moe so that if you're just wearing that it's not see through.

If Janet was an album kind of Artist, with no visuals, I would accept that. Janet is not just an album typer of artist. As a matter of fact, there were many songs I disliked by Janet whrn I first heard them, until I saw the video, or a performance. 

[BlackCat77]

If Janet was an album kind of Artist, with no visuals, I would accept that. Janet is not just an album typer of artist. As a matter of fact, there were many songs I disliked by Janet whrn I first heard them, until I saw the video, or a performance. 

I know how you feel 

Which songs? I'm curious because the same happened with me with some songs

[Dal]

Not necissarily, it could've been a cup to let the sides show, give a illusion of something that wasn't, again, not new. And guess what, the problem is, janet never had a a career of trying to "1 up" performances that everyone was talking about, I mean if she did a performance in a thong and carrying around a lizard after Britney did the sexy costume with a snake, I'd give you that "hey, that's how Janet does, she likes to try to upstage others" but that's just not factual. And Yea ofcourse it's not going anywhere, but yea you want to reignite the debate, here it is, and like with most debates, there's 2 different sides, and in this case neither side knows enough to  have their mind 100% made up, so it'll always be a topic that goes on & on.

HBO, is HBO, they show tit's all the time and say fuck, show fucking, The Superbowl is aired on a Primetime network. Showing her tits wasn't beneath her but showing it on a Primetime network is not something that before that she was known for, stunts in general on her Live Network TV performances weren't.And she obviously knows the difference between the 2 considering she's been working on TV and with many networks since she was a kid, she knows what's allowed and what's not.

You are sooooo reaching with that first line.. To give an illusion that her titty was out but it really wasn't out..?! Craaaazy! Lmao!

it's clear that she didn't know what was allowed.. Oh geez.. We sound like broken records..

and your argument that she's not a "1-up" artist sounds like it could make sense, until u think about the fact that when has she ever (up until that point) performed with another male artist and allowed them to rip anything off of her body?? I can't think of any other performance where she had another artist rip something off of her.. Does that mean that she wasn't meaning for Justin to rip anything off of her on the SB then?? Just cuz she hadn't done it up until that point doesn't mean that she could've never conceived of doing so for the first time on the SB.. She obviously did...and it backfired..

janet eff-ed up big time.. It was all her own doing (and partially Justin as well)... If you still can't explain what was supposed to happen then there were no other alternatives.. Her titty was always meant to pop out.. End of story..

Why tf would she allow a man to rip off ANY part of her clothes on national live television with millions of families and children watching?? Where was the good idea at?! Even if she didn't expose her breast, allowing a man to rip anything off her chest should've never been even considered for the SB.. She would've been blacklisted regardless..