When all the Greats have given their approval, why do people still hate on Beyonce?

[Illi]

I'm not saying what was said wasn't true, but I would like to see the source of the list.

[Mr. Wonder]

Illi, I must commend you for backing up your argument rather than just telling me I'm wrong, like everyone else did.

[Reyna ♔]

[Escapade]

I can't believe this thread is still going on

[bu.]

I actually have articles from the 80s where Janet was "criticised" (by the UK media). It might not be big (I can't remember) but it made me a lil angry.

Anyhow I should have never bumped this thread with that video. #oop. *drinks tea*

[bu.]

PS TMZ is a blog yet look at it's influences. When you have Sky news, BBC, and various places citing a blog as a source.....

[dimpy]

Sankofa, TOF, and everyone else, you see this ^^^^^^^??? This is how you rebuttal with another artist and support it with examples.

How does THIS (Madonna example) not fall under the "self-inflicted" category as well?

You all didn't give examples with another artist. You all just kept telling me I'm wrong, as usual.

I call bullshit. I told you about articles of Janet being called a weirdo, fat, strange, bad vocals, making fun of her hair, which was ALL talked about recently. I also gave Eminem as an example who has been scrutinized since 1998, and was quick to acknowledge that I'm positive you would just disregard it because it was "self-inflicted." Clearly it was there. Not my fault if you chose not to pay attention to any of it or "tossed" the evidence. I mean, did you read any of my posts? Like at all?

[Escapade]

So I guess that was what you were working on

[Mr. Wonder]

How does THIS (Madonna example) not fall under the "self-inflicted" category as well?

I call bullshit. I told you about articles of Janet being called a weirdo, fat, strange, bad vocals, making fun of her hair, which was ALL talked about recently. I also gave Eminem as an example who has been scrutinized since 1998, and was quick to acknowledge that I'm positive you would just disregard it because it was "self-inflicted." Clearly it was there. Not my fault if you chose not to pay attention to any of it or "tossed" the evidence. I mean, did you read any of my posts? Like at all?

It does. But Illi presented an argument and supported it.

I wasn't speaking about you specifically. It's a common understanding on here that whenever I'm making my points, everyone just tells me I'm wrong. They don't support their arguments or counter argue either. And somehow that makes them victorious in the argument. IDK how that works, you'd have to ask them. And Eminem's situation was self inflicted. Making songs about your mom doing crack and saying "faggot" repeatedly on an album, what do you think would come of it? And Janet's criticisms are not nearly as bad as Beyonce's, and they're short lived. 10 years later ppl are still brining up the "Survivor" situation.

[ThatOtherFan]

Austineisha is STILL trying to save face in this thread. :lmao: :lmao: :lmao:

How many of your tattered wigs have been snatched since I last posted?

There are wig pieces from Austineisha scattered throughout the last 10 pages atleast! :lmao:

[dimpy]

It does. But Illi presented an argument and supported it.

I wasn't speaking about you specifically. It's a common understanding on here that whenever I'm making my points, everyone just tells me I'm wrong. They don't support their arguments or counter argue either. And somehow that makes them victorious in the argument. IDK how that works, you'd have to ask them. And Eminem's situation was self inflicted. Making songs about your mom doing crack and saying "faggot" repeatedly on an album, what do you think would come of it? And Janet's criticisms are not nearly as bad as Beyonce's, and they're short lived. 10 years later ppl are still brining up the "Survivor" situation.

Ah. Well I did the same with mine

Saying whose criticisms are worse can be subjective, especially if there has been no backlash regarding them. Until there's backlash and a real effect, it's just empty words people are slinging. I haven't seen Bey suffer any real backlash in her career, nor have I seen it suffer in any way because of these things. Then again, I don't follow her like you do, so IDK.

I would argue that a lot of the petty things you listed with Bey could be considered "self-inflicted." And Em wasn't the first rapper to rap about drugs or say faggot. All the heat was put on him for something that had already been going on in hip-hop. It was a common thing for his genre, while others weren't criticized NEARLY as much as he was, and still can be. But, I digress, on both accounts.

[Mr. Wonder]

Ah. Well I did the same with mine

I would argue that a lot of the petty things you listed with Bey could be considered "self-inflicted." And Em wasn't the first rapper to rap about drugs or say faggot. All the heat was put on him for something that had already been going on in hip-hop. It was a common thing for his genre, while others weren't criticized NEARLY as much as he was, and still can be. But, I digress, on both accounts.

I must've missed it. Sorry.

I don't believe they are. Like I said, someone claims Beyonce staged herself riding a bike just for publicity. Like seriously? It doesn't get any more silly than that. And Eminem's use of said terminology was a bit more harsh than the Rap/Hip-Hop that I've listened to. So like IWon'tLetGo... said, when you're at the top, everyone is trying to bring you down.

[dimpy]

I must've missed it. Sorry.

I don't believe they are. Like I said, someone claims Beyonce staged herself riding a bike just for publicity. Like seriously? It doesn't get any more silly than that. And Eminem's use of said terminology was a bit more harsh than the Rap/Hip-Hop that I've listened to. So like IWon'tLetGo... said, when you're at the top, everyone is trying to bring you down.

You find that kinda petty shit on blogs ALL the time, which is why I say they are irrelevant in the grand scheme of things. Yes, people read them, but in the long run it has had no real effect on her career, unlike mainstream media sources could have an effect on it.

Yeah, he definitely took it to a new level, but that isn't what did it. It was the fact that he was so popular and so many people were/are listening to his records. I also have a race theory, that is some real backhanded racism towards AA's, but I think that's for another thread. And I agree with that statement 100%.

[ThatOtherFan]

I must've missed it. Sorry.

You missed because you didn't want to see it.

[Mr. Wonder]

You find that kinda petty shit on blogs ALL the time, which is why I say they are irrelevant in the grand scheme of things. Yes, people read them, but in the long run it has had no real effect on her career, unlike mainstream media sources could have an effect on it.

Yeah, he definitely took it to a new level, but that isn't what did it. It was the fact that he was so popular and so many people were/are listening to his records. I also have a race theory, that is some real backhanded racism towards AA's, but I think that's for another thread. And I agree with that statement 100%.

You can't rule out blogs because of their content. Do you really think high profile publications such as the NY Times or LA Times would be as pathetic as to ridicule an artist because of ridiculousness like unshaved legs? Of course not. There are some slip ups here and there, but they are more into bigger news stories. Plus, those type of media outlets aren't as integrated into the pop culture of music as say Rolling Stone or Entertainment Weekly. So that's why I think more highly regarded media aren't relevant in the bigger picture. Think about how much traffic MTO or Perez gets a day. Those more popular blogs reach a larger audience much quicker and easier, and are more accessible. Plus they have updates quite frequently. Millions see those posts and it perception of the stories are like a sponge. You may not realize that you're processing what the blog is saying, but you definitely are. As I stated previously, you can name any pop star from the past 30 years and I can go to Youtube and find at least 5 videos where Beyonce is mentioned - despite the video not even BEING ABOUT Beyonce - and they'll be some comment like "Beyonce needs to see this", "Beyonce stole this", "Beyonce will never be as good as so-and-so". Those videos aren't even about Beyonce. Why even bring her up? Like, I can go into a TLC or Rihanna thread and say something "shady", and someone will shade Beyonce or Destiny's Child. Like for what? It's little stuff like that that explains why her stans are always so on edge. Someone always has something to say. And I don't blame them. Just look at how ppl are on here towards Beyonce. Calling her music trash. If someone you like a lot said that about your artist you'd get a little agitated too. It's such hypocrisy, and I think it's hilarious.

[dimpy]

You can't rule out blogs because of their content. Do you really think high profile publications such as the NY Times or LA Times would be as pathetic as to ridicule an artist because of ridiculousness like unshaved legs? Of course not. There are some slip ups here and there, but they are more into bigger news stories. Plus, those type of media outlets aren't as integrated into the pop culture of music as say Rolling Stone or Entertainment Weekly. So that's why I think more highly regarded media aren't relevant in the bigger picture. Think about how much traffic MTO or Perez gets a day. Those more popular blogs reach a larger audience much quicker and easier, and are more accessible. Plus they have updates quite frequently. Millions see those posts and it perception of the stories are like a sponge. You may not realize that you're processing what the blog is saying, but you definitely are. As I stated previously, you can name any pop star from the past 30 years and I can go to Youtube and find at least 5 videos where Beyonce is mentioned - despite the video not even BEING ABOUT Beyonce - and they'll be some comment like "Beyonce needs to see this", "Beyonce stole this", "Beyonce will never be as good as so-and-so". Those videos aren't even about Beyonce. Why even bring her up? Like, I can go into a TLC or Rihanna thread and say something "shady", and someone will shade Beyonce or Destiny's Child. Like for what? It's little stuff like that that explains why her stans are always so on edge. Someone always has something to say. And I don't blame them. Just look at how ppl are on here towards Beyonce. Calling her music trash. If someone you like a lot said that about your artist you'd get a little agitated too. It's such hypocrisy, and I think it's hilarious.

I don't rule them out, I just say that they don't effect Beyonce in the grand scheme of her career. Is it annoying? Yes. That's why I don't visit those sites. And of course they wouldn't be pathetic as to do something like that, but that's not the point I'm making. I'm saying media scrutiny, on TV or from acclaimed critics, or people in the industry would effect Bey, blogs do nothing and I don't see how it's anything more than an annoyance in any famous person's life. All they do is ridicule everyone, and I get that. It's unnecessary, but that's really the point I'm getting at I just don't see it being any more serious than anyone else who is mentioned on those particular blogs. Bey is still doing her thing, and their opinions make no difference, no matter how much absorption is getting done.

I HATE that about YT videos. It's the same thing with Madonna and Janet though. A vid could have NOTHING to do with the other, but one will always be mentioned, "Janet/Madge could NEVER!" People don't do it as much, but I've seen it on Elton John and Billy Joel videos as well, and a LOT with Bieber. He's in every damn YT comment Things like that. If they're a similar artist or in the same genre, it automatically becomes a competition and one wants to clam superiority, though entirely unnecessary. Stans infiltrate YT and make a video into a competition. And with the TLC, Rihanna reference, of course they'll bring up Bey, they know what make certain people tick, and she's at the top, so she will be getting compared to everyone - she's the standard.

And with the Bey stans, to me it's like the chicken and the egg - which came first? Was it the annoying ass, big-headed stans, or was it the people who agitate the stans and then they (majority) became that way? The world may never know And we all know ANY stan group can do the most - that's kinda the my definition of being a stan, but Bey's are good at going the extra mile.

[ThatOtherFan]

And with the Bey stans, to me it's like the chicken and the egg - which came first? Was it the annoying ass, big-headed stans, or was it the people who agitate the stans and then they (majority) became that way? The world may never know And we all know ANY stan group can do the most - that's kinda the my definition of being a stan, but Bey's are good at going the extra mile.

I liked the whole post, but I like this section in particular.

At least Austineisha isn't ignoring posts anymore (outside of mine, be he's always ignoring my posts lol )

[Mr. Wonder]

I don't rule them out, I just say that they don't effect Beyonce in the grand scheme of her career. Is it annoying? Yes. That's why I don't visit those sites. And of course they wouldn't be pathetic as to do something like that, but that's not the point I'm making. I'm saying media scrutiny, on TV or from acclaimed critics, or people in the industry would effect Bey, blogs do nothing and I don't see how it's anything more than an annoyance in any famous person's life. All they do is ridicule everyone, and I get that. It's unnecessary, but that's really the point I'm getting at I just don't see it being any more serious than anyone else who is mentioned on those particular blogs. Bey is still doing her thing, and their opinions make no difference, no matter how much absorption is getting done.

I HATE that about YT videos. It's the same thing with Madonna and Janet though. A vid could have NOTHING to do with the other, but one will always be mentioned, "Janet/Madge could NEVER!" People don't do it as much, but I've seen it on Elton John and Billy Joel videos as well, and a LOT with Bieber. He's in every damn YT comment Things like that. If they're a similar artist or in the same genre, it automatically becomes a competition and one wants to clam superiority, though entirely unnecessary. Stans infiltrate YT and make a video into a competition. And with the TLC, Rihanna reference, of course they'll bring up Bey, they know what make certain people tick, and she's at the top, so she will be getting compared to everyone - she's the standard.

And with the Bey stans, to me it's like the chicken and the egg - which came first? Was it the annoying ass, big-headed stans, or was it the people who agitate the stans and then they (majority) became that way? The world may never know And we all know ANY stan group can do the most - that's kinda the my definition of being a stan, but Bey's are good at going the extra mile.

I see what you're saying, but there comes a time when you start to notice that some artists are getting a bit more hate than other artists. You might as well rename some of those blogs BeyonceTakeOut and Beyssip. Or even Britrez/Gagarez Hilton. And we all know Perez flip flops. One day he's kissing ass, the next he's hating. There came a time in 2010 when blogs were making stuff up JUST to talk about Beyonce. I remember a year or so when Beyonce was doing a photoshoot and she said the way her hair was braided was artistic. Ppl on this board picked her apart for that saying she was doing the most. Like, since when was cosmetology not art? Ppl on here said she needs to change her hair. Why should Beyonce have to change HER hair? It's really a lot of nitpicking that ppl do. I don't see any of this with any other female.

If there were an award for doing the most, MJ stans would be the gold medalist. Some of them committed suicide after he died. There's a rumor that one committed suicide a few years back because the doctor told him he would not perform a surgery on him just so he could look like MJ. Stans sent death threats to Conrad Murray. Evan Chandler and his family have had to change their names and move several times because MJ stans threatened to kill them. So if Beyonce stans are good at going the extra mile, then MJ stans might go a light year.

[dimpy]

I see what you're saying, but there comes a time when you start to notice that some artists are getting a bit more hate than other artists. You might as well rename some of those blogs BeyonceTakeOut and Beyssip. Or even Britrez/Gagarez Hilton. And we all know Perez flip flops. One day he's kissing ass, the next he's hating. There came a time in 2010 when blogs were making stuff up JUST to talk about Beyonce. I remember a year or so when Beyonce was doing a photoshoot and she said the way her hair was braided was artistic. Ppl on this board picked her apart for that saying she was doing the most. Like, since when was cosmetology not art? Ppl on here said she needs to change her hair. Why should Beyonce have to change HER hair? It's really a lot of nitpicking that ppl do. I don't see any of this with any other female.

If there were an award for doing the most, MJ stans would be the gold medalist. Some of them committed suicide after he died. There's a rumor that one committed suicide a few years back because the doctor told him he would not perform a surgery on him just so he could look like MJ. Stans sent death threats to Conrad Murray. Evan Chandler and his family have had to change their names and move several times because MJ stans threatened to kill them. So if Beyonce stans are good at going the extra mile, then MJ stans might go a light year.

I won't disagree with that, but my bottom line on the issue still stands, that with all of these artists, and flip-flopping, in the grand scheme, it doesn't effect their careers. And I think with people on the forum, that harks back to the, you want to bring down who is on top thing, and such. Also on forums, that's kind of the point. People make threads, then 20 different opinions on the subject posted gets commented on, then other people have opinions about their opinions, and it just goes on and on, but that's generally what happens on forums, it's just more a question of who will be the subject of the nitpicking this time. And of course on a Janet board you will get more Bey-scrimination than other forums. That'll be a given.

Oh lawd. Don't get me started on the MJ stans. They are a whole new breed of crazy. Everyone knows it, and everyone treats most of them as such, as well. They're completely different than Bey stans though, therefore are treated differently. Most of them are just delusional and far too obsessed, among other things, which generally makes other stan groups allow them to bask in their obsession and delusion, whereas Bey stans are seen as grating and arrogant and far too aggressive. Also I've seen time and time again on twitter, stans will drag someone for the simplest thing, like today. "I don't know what's wrong with me, but I can't seem to get into Beyonce's music," and stans took that and RAN laps with her wig...why? But the subject wasn't MJ stans, it was Bey stans, and I was just commenting on why people have such an issue with them - for me it's their whole attitude (again, I'm making generalizations) that I can't stand, mostly because I detest when I'm unable to sense an ounce of humility from any human being, and that covers most of them

[dimpy]

double post

[dimpy]

I liked the whole post, but I like this section in particular.

At least Austineisha isn't ignoring posts anymore (outside of mine, be he's always ignoring my posts lol )

Thanks

Aww, lmao. Well it's probably a good thing cause it looks like all of us took a deep breath and calmed our pusses

[Mr. Wonder]

I won't disagree with that, but my bottom line on the issue still stands, that with all of these artists, and flip-flopping, in the grand scheme, it doesn't effect their careers. And I think with people on the forum, that harks back to the, you want to bring down who is on top thing, and such. Also on forums, that's kind of the point. People make threads, then 20 different opinions on the subject posted gets commented on, then other people have opinions about their opinions, and it just goes on and on, but that's generally what happens on forums, it's just more a question of who will be the subject of the nitpicking this time. And of course on a Janet board you will get more Bey-scrimination than other forums. That'll be a given.

Oh lawd. Don't get me started on the MJ stans. They are a whole new breed of crazy. Everyone knows it, and everyone treats most of them as such, as well. They're completely different than Bey stans though, therefore are treated differently. Most of them are just delusional and far too obsessed, among other things, which generally makes other stan groups allow them to bask in their obsession and delusion, whereas Bey stans are seen as grating and arrogant and far too aggressive. Also I've seen time and time again on twitter, stans will drag someone for the simplest thing, like today. "I don't know what's wrong with me, but I can't seem to get into Beyonce's music," and stans took that and RAN laps with her wig...why? But the subject wasn't MJ stans, it was Bey stans, and I was just commenting on why people have such an issue with them

Well of course the scrutiny doesn't effect the career because that comes with the baggage. But the funny thing is, if we were to discuss how much scrutiny another artist gets, I have a feeling fans/stans of that artist would be using the same sources I did. But somehow I'm wrong when I use them. But I'm used to it. It's been that way since 2009. Everyone is against me and they just tell me I'm wrong over and over and somehow they feel victorious despite presenting no argument.

And I cosign everything about the MJ stans. They live in a fairy land where MJ is Peter Pan and everyone else is Thumbelina and company and it's a utopia. They don't want to believe that interventions happened, MJ had a drug addiction, or that he is not the creator of rap. I KNOW you remember when someone on Twitter said MJ created hip-hop. As delusional as ppl claim Beyonce is, I have NEVER seen any of them go that far into the delusion. The Beyonce fans that I follow on Twitter don't really get riled up over simple stuff. Call "4" a flop and they'll go off.

[dimpy]

Well of course the scrutiny doesn't effect the career because that comes with the baggage. But the funny thing is, if we were to discuss how much scrutiny another artist gets, I have a feeling fans/stans of that artist would be using the same sources I did. But somehow I'm wrong when I use them. But I'm used to it. It's been that way since 2009. Everyone is against me and they just tell me I'm wrong over and over and somehow they feel victorious despite presenting no argument.

And I cosign everything about the MJ stans. They live in a fairy land where MJ is Peter Pan and everyone else is Thumbelina and company and it's a utopia. They don't want to believe that interventions happened, MJ had a drug addiction, or that he is not the creator of rap. I KNOW you remember when someone on Twitter said MJ created hip-hop. As delusional as ppl claim Beyonce is, I have NEVER seen any of them go that far into the delusion. The Beyonce fans that I follow on Twitter don't really get riled up over simple stuff. Call "4" a flop and they'll go off.

Well, hell. All in a day right?

That's what I don't like about most stans in general. They can never admit fault, even if it's right in front of their faces. I've had an MJ stan blame Janet for Michael's addiction, or the fact he never recovered from it rather, more than they ever put ANY responsibility on him Noooooo NOT that he created hip-hop in the 90s!!!! And to think I had blocked that out of my memory and then you sent them the link on the history of hip-hop and they completely disregarded it. I was sooooo done with that bitch :lmao:

[Mr. Wonder]

Well, hell. All in a day right?

That's what I don't like about most stans in general. They can never admit fault, even if it's right in front of their faces. I've had an MJ stan blame Janet for Michael's addiction, or the fact he never recovered from it rather, more than they ever put ANY responsibility on him Noooooo NOT that he created hip-hop in the 90s!!!! And to think I had blocked that out of my memory and then you sent them the link on the history of hip-hop and they completely disregarded it. I was sooooo done with that bitch :lmao:

It sure is. I always fight to the death even if means going for 20 something odd pages. I'm gonna get my damn point across.

That's why I think that if you can't admit flaws in your artist, then you're not a real stan. Like a few pages back with the SB thing. Ya'll know DAMN WELL Janet did that shit intentionally. Yet, according to Sankofa, I was throwing Janet under the bus. On top of the fact that she and TOF thought I was comparing Beyonce and MJ. Just no comprehension skills.

Ch...I was just flabbergasted at that tweet. I was official done with MJ stans at that point. I know every stan can be a bit delusional at times, but that shit there? That wasn't just a cross over the line. That was a damn pole vault.

[dimpy]

It sure is. I always fight to the death even if means going for 20 something odd pages. I'm gonna get my damn point across.

That's why I think that if you can't admit flaws in your artist, then you're not a real stan. Like a few pages back with the SB thing. Ya'll know DAMN WELL Janet did that shit intentionally. Yet, according to Sankofa, I was throwing Janet under the bus. On top of the fact that she and TOF thought I was comparing Beyonce and MJ. Just no comprehension skills.

Ch...I was just flabbergasted at that tweet. I was official done with MJ stans at that point. I know every stan can be a bit delusional at times, but that shit there? That wasn't just a cross over the line. That was a damn pole vault.

Because Gemini's like the last word, and are always right, even when they are wrong. Correct?

That's why I don't even like being called a stan, because I associate them with delusion, among other things, though of course there are some exceptions. And I didn't see it as throwing Janet under the bus by thinking she did it on purpose. I personally don't care what people think on that subject. What got me was saying she deserved all THAT backlash and everything that happened as a result, knowing damn well that whole thing was blown entirely out of proportion, and she is the only one who suffered because she was the black female, and that she knew it was going to happen. That was reaching

And the fact that she kept going though...it was like looking at a green highlighter and NO MATTER WHAT, the bitch would insist that it's a sharpie. DEAD @ a pole vault. I am over MJ stans for the most part. I pity them too. Poor things don't even know their brains aren't functioning at a normal level

But on that note I'm going to bed. Goodnight lovelies