Backtracking: Twenty Years of janet. Jimmy Jam Interview

[Escapade]

May 18th, 2013, was the twentieth anniversary of Janet Jackson's expansive - and epic - janet. LP. To celebrate, I talked to the legendary Jimmy Jam who, along with his partner Terry Lewis, produced janet. The piece is up now at Idolator.

My interview with Jimmy yielded far more fascinating information than I could fit in the piece, so below are his words on a variety of subjects related to America's little sister, Janet.

On the James Brown sample in That's The Way Love Goes

I’m a huge James Brown fan, so to be able to sample a James Brown song [Papa Don’t Take No Mess] and actually make it into a sensual song for me was a lot of fun, just as a producer. We had to get permission, because he clears all his own samples, right? He wanted do know what they lyrics were. He was cool…. He said, "I liked that, I like that, I just wanna make sure everything is good with the lyrics.” and we’re like "Yeah yeah, it’s nothing risqué or anything like that, Mr. Brown." He ended up liking it - it was real cool.

On Janet’s growth as a songwriter

The great thing about working with her was the chance to watch her grow up and watch her change and gain more confidence.... She came into her own. When we got to Rhythm Nation, I had done the [instrumental] track to Miss You Much and I just pointed at a note on one of the keyboards and she just walked in and hit the key and that became the string part on the song. She had lyric ideas walking into the studio. Janet was another evolution of that, Velvet Rope was another evolution of that, you know what I mean? She just got more confident and more into it and enjoyed the process of writing. We won a Best Song Grammy for That’s The Way Love Goes and I said [to Janet] “You know what the significance of winning this Grammy is?” and she says, “No, what?” I said, “You won this Grammy as a songwriter. This is a song writing award.” She said, “Wow, that is so cool.”

On why Janet's writing is crucial to the quality of her albums

I love her writing. We’ve done later albums with her that were not as successful and I would say that it was probably equal parts too many cooks in the kitchen and not enough writing by her. Because she wasn’t ready to make a record. When we were going in to start the All For You album, we had some good ideas and she honestly was kind of like, “I don’t really know what I want to talk about, I’m not sure what I want the album to be about. Terry can write the lyrics.” And we were like, “No no no, that’s not right, you gotta figure out something, you’ve got to write the lyrics. We’ll come up with the tracks." And she said, ‘Well, I’m not sure.” So after about a month, we were putting tracks together and she was up for three movies. She really wanted to do a movie... She got Nutty Professor – she was a big Eddie Murphy fan. We moved the album back… we came up with Doesn’t Really Matter for the movie.

[soon thereafter Nothing Really Matters became a #1 hit] “Now once again she was focused and ready and excited about making an album... All For You and Someone To Call My Lover and all those songs came off the energy of Doesn’t Really Matter. It’s important for her to be involved in the process, because her energy is such an important part of it. Some of the later albums where, like I said, there were too many cooks in the kitchen or she really wasn’t writing, those records were not as successful. I’m not saying that’s the definitive reason, but in my mind that had a lot to do with it. If you’re a songwriter and you say, “I have nothing to write about," then you need to go live some life and find some stuff to write about.

On recording If

I feel so blessed as a producer to have a muse like that to create stuff with, because there’s no barrier. No "I can’t sing that because it’s too high/too low.” When we did If, I said "Can you sing down low?" and she said "Yeah, I think so.” She said "What kind of melody do you hear?" and I said "I hear a like an Indian chant" and the next thing, she came back with lyrics that followed that rhythm. It’s one thing for me to think wow, it’s be cool if that was the rhythm, but it’s another thing for her to actually do it with words. Part of her genius is her rhythmic sense with lyrics… she sings and it almost becomes another instrument.

Before we started the process of recording, in our time apart we’d play each other songs that we liked in the meantime. I remember playing her a bunch of old Motown stuff... we used a bit of Love Child in You Want This. She would play me things from opera to flamenco. Her musical palate was so wide in the things she liked.

On what I suggested I thought was a key ingredient to Janet's sound, the “harmony stacks”

Janet and Ralph Tresvant of New Edition both have the same discipline, which is the ability hear notes that are next to each other, but still stack them. We always wanted Janet to do her own backgrounds, we wanted her voice to be the dominant voice no matter what. She would have to work really hard. We’d do it so that it would be like a warm up, like, "Let’s do these backgrounds first to warm up your voice for the lead. By the time you get done with the backgrounds, you’ll be so happy to do the lead vocals" I stacked maybe a four or five part harmony and we’d do it four or five times on each note, so we’d end up with twenty tracks of just backgrounds, It could be oohs and ahhs. It’s patience, discipline, but it’s also trust. I would throw a note at her on the keyboard and it would sound like that note’s not gonna work. After maybe the second song we did, she trusted me. When it was done, it would be this great harmony. There would be a few dissonant notes in there, but somehow it would just work. The only other person I’ve worked with who can do this as well as Janet is Ralph Tresvant. A lot of singers they don’t want to do it and we don’t even try it. Those harmonies are something special.

On the genesis of her early hit, Nasty

Nasty was about these guys that were bothering her at a club and she kept looking over at me and Terry like we were supposed to come over and save her and we just kind of stood there. A bunch of people were standing around us going, “Shouldn't y'all go over? Janet looks like she's being bothered over there.” We're like, “No, we got her, we can see her, she's fine, no problem.” And then she came over and said, “Those guys were so nasty, how come you didn't come over and help me?” We said, “Well, you obviously did fine by yourself since you're standing here with us now.”

On What Have You Done For Me Lately?

Me and Terry were working on an album at the time and we had done that track. John McClain, the A&R person who got us hooked up with Janet, was in the car listening to our album and he said “I need that track! That needs be on the Janet album.” And we’re like, “John, that’s our track!" We hadn’t put any lyrics to it - we just had the track, so I said “Well, I'll put it on and if Janet likes it, it's hers.” So we put it on and she got a big smile on her face and said “Who’s that for?” and we said, “You, if you want it.” And she says “Oh I want it!” and I said, “Okay, cool.”

At the end of the interview, I asked Jimmy about the so-called demise of albums, and how Adele proved this isn't entirely true. His answer was thoughtful...

I think the idea of people appreciating a single song and buying it is good, because that is something that did get lost for awhile, with such an importance on albums.

I just remember for me, I didn't know about albums growing up, but I knew singles that I liked and I'd always beg my mom, "Hey can I get this?" James Brown or Smokey Robinson. Whatever those songs were, I would have to do that. When I got a little older, I probably liked Chicago - they were one of my favorites - so I would go get the new Chicago album and I'd love it and I'd read the liner notes. There was an experience, a kind of maturation process, going from being a singles buyer to an albums buyer. It's almost like a rite of passage. That got lost, because labels kind of de-emphasized singles to make albums, right? They wouldn't even put a single out commercially; they'd say, 'Buy the album."

Now what we have is... people like a single and they can get it. That's fine with me, I like the idea of that. because what happens is, I still think that maturation process can happen... Adele's a perfect example, then you have that phenomenon. If people buy her album and like it, then they won't be totally opposed to buying an album from someone else. If we do Janet and we do the complete album, I'm gonna think of it as an album. We're gonna still put segues between the songs... We should make it like that, but I'm not gonna begrudge people if they just wanna pick and choose and go, "I don't want the whole box of chocolates, but I'll take the ones with the macadamia nuts." That's fine... but at least I'm gonna make a nice box of chocolates.

http://xolondon.blogspot.ca/2013/05/backtracking-twenty-years-of-janet.html

[hotboy06]

I feel so blessed as a producer to have a muse like that to create stuff with, because there’s no barrier. No "I can’t sing that because it’s too high/too low.” When we did If, I said "Can you sing down low?" and she said "Yeah, I think so.” She said "What kind of melody do you hear?" and I said "I hear a like an Indian chant" and the next thing, she came back with lyrics that followed that rhythm. It’s one thing for me to think wow, it’s be cool if that was the rhythm, but it’s another thing for her to actually do it with words. Part of her genius is her rhythmic sense with lyrics… she sings and it almost becomes another instrument.

What kind of talent?

[hotboy06]

What kind of insight of Janhova's creative mind?

[hotboy06]

DEAD @ the inspiration for "Nasty".. :lmao: :lmao: Ugh, I love JJ & TT..I'm glad they let Janet get her experiences for the songs for albums.

[Laveaux]

what a fantastic read. if I wasn't ready for an album, I most certainly am now.

[aed05]

On what I suggested I thought was a key ingredient to Janet's sound, the “harmony stacks”

Janet and Ralph Tresvant of New Edition both have the same discipline, which is the ability hear notes that are next to each other, but still stack them. We always wanted Janet to do her own backgrounds, we wanted her voice to be the dominant voice no matter what. She would have to work really hard. We’d do it so that it would be like a warm up, like, "Let’s do these backgrounds first to warm up your voice for the lead. By the time you get done with the backgrounds, you’ll be so happy to do the lead vocals" I stacked maybe a four or five part harmony and we’d do it four or five times on each note, so we’d end up with twenty tracks of just backgrounds, It could be oohs and ahhs. It’s patience, discipline, but it’s also trust. I would throw a note at her on the keyboard and it would sound like that note’s not gonna work. After maybe the second song we did, she trusted me. When it was done, it would be this great harmony. There would be a few dissonant notes in there, but somehow it would just work. The only other person I’ve worked with who can do this as well as Janet is Ralph Tresvant. A lot of singers they don’t want to do it and we don’t even try it. Those harmonies are something special.

I recieved so much life from this portion of the interview I just..........

If I knew where yall got all those little gif thingys I'd post the one of that black girl from ANTM crying and doing the fist pump!

[SloLove]

i love this....this needs to happen! Janet Jackson, Jimmy Jam, Terry Lewis and thats it!

[vibeology]

This is a great read

It also helps me understand why i was younger i thought "Sensitivity" by Ralph Tresvant, was sung by Janet.

[Rock & Roll Hall of Game]

He did another interview where he stated Janet and him made 4 songs together since 2010

[J.]

Janet is coming back to SLAY I tell you. Jimmy knows Janet and has been in her ear. Prediction: The 11th album will be better than All For You.

[ThatOtherFan]

I recieved so much life from this portion of the interview I just..........

If I knew where yall got all those little gif thingys I'd post the one of that black girl from ANTM crying and doing the fist pump!

[Rock & Roll Hall of Game]

Janet is coming back to SLAY I tell you. Jimmy knows Janet and has been in her ear. Prediction: The 11th album will be better than All For You.

Mmm child..

[janetDAYZ]

See, its stuff like this that the avg person isn't aware of about Janet's artistry when they just wanna pass her off as a non singing artist who can just dance. They don't know how involved,dedicated and determined she actually is in her material . Farrrr more than just a dancer

[jarrylf]

Theres a whole other part of the interview I found.

Janet Jackson’s ‘janet.’ Turns 20: Backtracking

Stephen Sears May 20th, 2013

Backtracking is our recurring look back at the pop music that shaped our lives. Friends may come and go, but we’ll be spinning our favorite albums forever.

“We had the kind of night where morning comes too soon…” So goes the seductive spoken intro that launched Janet Jackson’s fifth album, janet. — that’s a little j with an emphatic period — released on May 18, 1993. Following the social consciousness of her previous blockbuster, 1989’s Rhythm Nation 1814, Jackson returned with a fresh sound and look, and free-spirited confidence. The new music was everything from pure pop to candles-in-the-bedroom grooves, balancing the sweet, the erotic and the playful.

To celebrate the 20th anniversary of the album that launched nine singles, Idolator spoke to Jimmy Jam, one-half of Jackson’s legendary production team, Jam and [Terry] Lewis. Looking back on the recording today, Jam feels the muse is obvious.

“Janet was in love. My partner [Lewis] was with someone who he was very much in love with at the time, and I was with someone I was very much in love with,” Jam says. “Love was in the air… when we did Rhythm Nation, everybody called it the ‘What’s Going On’ album, and then they called janet. the ‘Let’s Get It On’ album.”

Like a moth to the flame, burned by the fire

What eventually became the janet. album would be Jackson’s first under a new multimillion dollar contract with Virgin Records; all eyes were on the trio as they began to work at Jam and Lewis’s studio in Minneapolis. Throughout the fall of 1992, the three of them began creating the music what would become a sprawling album of varied styles: 14 songs and 13 interludes.

“That’s The Way Love Goes”

For both Jam and Lewis today, janet.’s definitive track is the silky, chilled “That’s The Way Love Goes.” Initially, though, Jackson didn’t love the instrumental demo. Determined to win her over, Jam slipped it onto a cassette he gave Jackson for her winter break in Anguilla. When she returned in January, he remembers, “She says ‘We gotta work on that track… I wasn’t hearing it, but now I totally hear it.’”

Jackson, who stayed with Jam (real name: James Harris) and his wife during the sessions, soon buzzed his home intercom at one in the morning. “She said, ‘Are you awake?’ I said ‘Umm, I am now!’ She says, ‘I got the idea for the song. That’s the way love goes… but in a good way.’ We went and recorded it that day and it sort of set the tone for what the album was.“

By this time, Virgin label heads had already flown to Minneapolis to check on their new signing. Jam, Lewis and Jackson played them a rough cut of the industrial dance/sex epic “If” and the label latched onto it as the first single. Jam and Lewis felt differently. When their star later flew to Los Angeles on business, they had their chance to convince everyone that “That’s The Way Love Goes” was the real first single. Jam talks about how they pressed Jackson to make the pitch:

“Janet goes, ‘Yeah, you’re right!’ Then she comes back a week later and says, ‘Well… guys, it looks like ‘If’ is going to be the single. The record label feels it could have a great dance video…’ So we were finishing up recording later with Chuck D and we played him and [hip hop producer] Hank Shocklee the two songs. They said, ‘If. That’s like Janet saying I’m back!’ So Janet’s looking at us like ‘See? See!?’ And then he (Chuck) goes, ‘But that other song… you know when Sade releases a record and it’s not like a bunch of hype? She just slips it out there and you say, ‘Oh my God listen to this!?’ It introduces itself.” And we’re looking at Janet like, ‘See!?’”

Jackson enlisted her then-secret husband Rene Elizondo to direct the video. “To me, no one else could have directed that,” Jam says. The gold-hued clip, which featured Jackson hanging with her friends and dancers (including an unknown-at-the-time Jennifer Lopez) was the most accessible version of the star the public had ever seen. “He captured [her life] because he knew what that was.” The single went to #1 on the Hot 100, soon followed by the suits’ pick, the Diana Ross-sampling “If.”

“If”

She’s strong and that’s a fact

Stylistically, janet. is brazenly ambitious, nailing rock (“What’ll I Do”), house disco (“Throb”), delicate balladry (“Again”) and even pop-rock opera on the vengeful, dramatic “This Time,” which featured a soaring guest vocal by opera diva Kathleen Battle.

“The people Janet chose to collaborate with were people who inspired her, not necessarily people that were ‘Well, we’ll put them on the record and it will sell.’ That was really not part of the thought process,” says Jam. An element in her increasing confidence, he believes, was filming her role in John Singleton’s 1993 film Poetic Justice.

“Again”

“Poetic Justice was pivotal to where she was at in her life, “says Jam. “It was a great experience for her, being around Tupac and John Singleton, Maya Angelou. She was hungry to make a record after that. You have to be inspired by something, to have something you want to say and, to me, Poetic Justice… opened her mind to a lot of things.”

There’s a clear line connecting Jackson’s poetry-writing character, Justice, and the lyrical content of “New Agenda,” janet.’s most overt political statement and, 20 years on, the album’s most bracing track. “There’s a million samples in there [including Average White Band and Stevie Wonder],” Jam says. “The idea was to make it sonically sound like a Public Enemy record. Hank Shocklee took these dissonant samples that shouldn’t have gone together and somehow made it all work.”

Jackson enlisted Public Enemy rapper Chuck D to write and perform a feminist rap. She told a magazine at the time, “When I hear Chuck, it’s like I’m hearing someone teaching.” And there’s Janet’s own voice, inspired by writers like Angelou. “There’s nothing you can do, accept me for who I am now,” she sang, “African American woman, I stand tall with pride.”

Create the mood for love, sensual physical love

The album, in classic Janet style, ends with a run of baby makers — a series of slow jams that includes “Any Time, Any Place,” the regretful “Where Are You Now? and “The Body That Loves You.”

“Any Time, Any Place”

Of the latter song, Jam says, “I thought her lyrics were so good. She was really into Brazilian music at the time and she said ‘I’d love to do something with just acoustic guitar.’ You have to realize how great it is… [she’s] not showing you a hit record and going ‘Make me something that sounds like this.’ She’s bringing you Gilberto Gil…. these different things. If you’re a producer worth your salt, you’re hearing this and going, ‘How can I give something this feel and make it her? Because if you give it the right feel, it is all her.”

Twenty years on, the influence of janet. is literally all over the radio. Like the samples Jam and Lewis layered into the album, “Any Time, Any Place” is now sampled on Kendrick Lamar’s recent hit “Poetic Justice.”

“My son had never heard the actual janet. record,” says Jam. “He kept going, ‘So that part that goes like that, did you do that?’ and I said, ‘Yeah that’s on the original record.’ I remember thinking [of Lamar’s track], that’s an interesting treatment… not sure if it’s gonna work, but then hearing it on the radio, it’s a natural. Janet is a fan of the record. “

Hold on baby

For the album cover, Jackson chose what appeared to be a simple head shot. When the image was fully revealed, it featured a topless Jackson, with Elizondo’s hands cupping her bare breasts. Provocative, yes, but the serenity on her face gave the image a warm sensuality.

“Rene was such a brilliant collaborator,” Jam says. “During the time that it was good in their relationship, he was so good for her, he was such a creative guy. It was his idea, to take that kind of shot. He not only had the vision, but he also had her trust and her love. He was a great photographer; he was a great video director. He had a great conceptual eye.“

“Because Of Love”

Because of love, we are together

The legacy of Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis’s work with Janet isn’t taken for granted. “I feel so blessed as a producer to have a muse like that to create stuff with, because there’s no barrier,” Jam says. Prior to Michael Jackson’s death in 2009, Jam, Lewis and Janet had finished four new songs. “I listened to them [recently] and they’re really good. I think her fans would love it, get it, and understand what it is. It’s not trying to be anything it’s not, it’s just good Janet songs… and she knows, we’ve talked… she just got married and she’s enjoying life. She’s making noises about wanting to do an album. But we will see. If I’m her, I’m just living life and enjoying myself. Whenever she’s ready to do it, we’re ready, and it’s just a matter of whether we see eye to eye on what that should be.”

Until that time arrives, fans have Jackson’s amazing imperial run of hit albums to revisit. Jam is clearly proud of janet. and the memories it evokes.

“Me and Terry were the beneficiaries of the Janet that walked into the studio with this kind of fresh approach to things, and an excitement to make a record,” says the producer. “Everything was just really good in everybody’s life. Everybody was on a creative high.”

Idolator will be hosting a janet. re-listening party on Twitter today (Monday, May 20) at 4 p.m. ET. For more commentary from Jimmy Jam about the album, check out Stephen Sears’ blog, The Middle Eight.

I LOVE Jimmy for alll thedetails!

[aed05]

YAAAASSS!!!!!!!!!

[bu.]

LEGEND

[ray.]

The people Janet chose to collaborate with were people who inspired her, not necessarily people that were ‘Well, we’ll put them on the record and it will sell.'

shade.

[Laveaux]

“Poetic Justice was pivotal to where she was at in her life, “says Jam. “It was a great experience for her, being around Tupac and John Singleton, Maya Angelou. She was hungry to make a record after that. You have to be inspired by something, to have something you want to say and, to me, Poetic Justice… opened her mind to a lot of things.”

I LOVE Jimmy for alll thedetails!

ive been saying that for the longest. Janet is at her best when she has some sort of inspiration to feed off of. Rather it be her relationship to Rene or her brother Michael or a movie role...I think her last three albums missed the mark because she didn't have any inspiration behind it. I believe she is getting inspired by a lot of things these days and I cant wait for her to come back and show people why she is Queen. Bitch is gonna shit.

[Paul]

I just love janet

This and the comments in the other one "I have the final say" just goes to show how powerful and in control she is

[Unbreakable.]

Genius.

[Shawn1814]

On what I suggested I thought was a key ingredient to Janet's sound, the “harmony stacks”

On what I suggested I thought was a key ingredient to Janet's sound, the “harmony stacks”

Janet and Ralph Tresvant of New Edition both have the same discipline, which is the ability hear notes that are next to each other, but still stack them. We always wanted Janet to do her own backgrounds, we wanted her voice to be the dominant voice no matter what. She would have to work really hard. We’d do it so that it would be like a warm up, like, "Let’s do these backgrounds first to warm up your voice for the lead. By the time you get done with the backgrounds, you’ll be so happy to do the lead vocals" I stacked maybe a four or five part harmony and we’d do it four or five times on each note, so we’d end up with twenty tracks of just backgrounds, It could be oohs and ahhs. It’s patience, discipline, but it’s also trust. I would throw a note at her on the keyboard and it would sound like that note’s not gonna work. After maybe the second song we did, she trusted me. When it was done, it would be this great harmony. There would be a few dissonant notes in there, but somehow it would just work. The only other person I’ve worked with who can do this as well as Janet is Ralph Tresvant. A lot of singers they don’t want to do it and we don’t even try it. Those harmonies are something special.

This is why I always said she was miles ahead of Madonna... Her songs have soooo many layers with the production, vocal arrangements, harmonies and lyrics...

[RedSimba]

Janet is the goddess of self harmonies~ they are pure magic!

Oh and Rizz's are good too lol. I would've loved a duet from them

[Unbreakable.]

Her vocal arrangements are unparelled! She always gives the song what it needs.